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Post by hibernicus on Aug 18, 2012 21:26:59 GMT
To return to the thread topic, church architecture - I was reading a biography of Herbert Cardinal Vaughan (Archbishop of Westminster 1892-1903) who built Westminster Cathedral, and it stated that the reason why the Byzantine style was chosen for it was that the support walls for a Byzantine building can be put up relatively quickly (the same would presumably be true of Romanesque) whereas a Gothic building must be built in stages and takes significantly longer. I suspect this is the answer to my question about why Gothic tended to fall out of favour in the early C20 whereas Byzantine, Romanesque, and neo-classical styles enjoyed a revival.
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Post by loughcrew on Aug 27, 2012 10:35:03 GMT
St. Nicholas's Chapel in Stabannon, County Louth is worth visiting for it's wonderful interior which has not been mucked about with too much and retains a very spiritual atmosphere.
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Post by hibernicus on Aug 29, 2012 19:41:36 GMT
Here's another odd little feature of the windows of St Kevin's Church. I wondered why the window of St John the Evangelist does not have his eagle and instead has him holding a chalice with a winged serpent or dragon rising from it. I wondered if there had been a mix-up or adaptation of the image of another saint, but it seems that this is a known (though relatively rare) depiction of St John, based on a legend that he was offered poison to drink but blessed the cup, whereupon the poison rose out of it in the form of a serpent. What does surprise me, though, is that St John is not shown holding his gospel and that he is holding a palm of martyrdom. Surely St John was the only Apostle who was not martyred? BTW the stained glass window of St John in St Brendan's Cathedral, Loughrea is very fine- main image shows the Transfiguration with St John as a young man, smaller image shows the elderly St John receiving the Apocalypse. Wish I could have made it to Loughrea again this year for the TLM.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Aug 19, 2013 8:25:10 GMT
I was in St Patrick's Church, Trim, Co Meath over the weekend. Built 1902, neo-Gothic with a Celtic Revival interior. Stain-glass panels of St Patrick preaching in Tara and of Our Lady of Trim (see here: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trim,_County_Meath ) Certainly worth a look.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Oct 30, 2013 11:51:38 GMT
I was in St Mary's Cathedral in Kilkenny for the first time yesterday (I was in the area and I called in). A very fine church. Well worth a look.
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Post by hibernicus on Oct 30, 2013 22:49:16 GMT
This is probably the place to note that the scaffolding is now being taken down from the sanctuary in St KEvin's and the restored stained-glass, paintwork etc seems quite stunning. It will be fully revealed in the next couple of weeks.
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Post by Askel McThurkill on Nov 4, 2013 15:49:46 GMT
Will look forward to seeing it.
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Post by hibernicus on Nov 5, 2013 22:34:01 GMT
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Post by hibernicus on Jan 13, 2014 22:45:45 GMT
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Post by hibernicus on Dec 16, 2014 22:15:17 GMT
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Post by Young Ireland on Dec 16, 2014 22:21:14 GMT
I suspect that one reason why there is such enthusiasm for wreckovations is that they remind certain people of pre-VII Catholicism, and thus to be done away with as an apparent anachronism. I also suspect that pet ideas about "community-led" celebrations play a factor as well.
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Post by hibernicus on Dec 16, 2014 22:27:54 GMT
But the question is, WHY does "pre-Vatican II Catholicism" arouse such hatred? And one point that the article's author makes is that wreckovation was often imposed over the protests of actually-existing communities.
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Post by Young Ireland on Dec 16, 2014 22:41:40 GMT
But the question is, WHY does "pre-Vatican II Catholicism" arouse such hatred? And one point that the article's author makes is that wreckovation was often imposed over the protests of actually-existing communities. At the end of the day, I think it is the diocesan bureaucracy, who appear to be a good deal more liberal liturgically than Mass-goers in general who have the ultimate say in what churches get "re-modelled" rather than the communities themselves. Regards the first question, maybe bad experiences with the Church in their younger days? I also would like to clarify that I don't sympathise with those doing the wreckovations, but rather trying to explore why they support such.
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Post by hibernicus on Dec 19, 2014 23:10:03 GMT
Part of the attitude behind wreckovation is, I think, a dislike of the concept of "sacred space" set aside and marked out as such, on the grounds that (a) it's authoritarian/monarchical/encourages passive reverence (hence Aidan Matthews' comparison of removing communion rails to the fall of the Berlin Wall; this is what lies behind Young Ireland's suggestion that it reflects bad experiences of the pre-conciliar church (b) it encourages a view that religion is something that takes place in the special space but can be ignored outside it - as with the mafioso going to Communion (c) it obscures awareness that everything is sacred as part of creation - the problem being that if everything's sacred nothing's sacred
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Post by Young Ireland on Dec 19, 2014 23:27:57 GMT
Part of the attitude behind wreckovation is, I think, a dislike of the concept of "sacred space" set aside and marked out as such, on the grounds that (a) it's authoritarian/monarchical/encourages passive reverence (hence Aidan Matthews' comparison of removing communion rails to the fall of the Berlin Wall; this is what lies behind Young Ireland's suggestion that it reflects bad experiences of the pre-conciliar church (b) it encourages a view that religion is something that takes place in the special space but can be ignored outside it - as with the mafioso going to Communion (c) it obscures awareness that everything is sacred as part of creation - the problem being that if everything's sacred nothing's sacred Your first point is exactly what I had in mind, but perhaps didn't espouse very coherently (I will re-iterate that I do not endorse this reaction against the pre-conciliar church, but rather putting it forth as a "Devil's Advocate" position, so that we can understand their mindset and act accordingly). I also agree with your other two points.
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