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Post by royalosiodhachain on Jun 16, 2008 2:49:49 GMT
The following is a document from the Vatican of the Catholic church outlining the scandal created by the misrepresentation of protestant communites as inheritors of the Body of Christ. DECREE ON ECUMENISM UNITATIS REDINTEGRATIO
INTRODUCTION
1. The restoration of unity among all Christians is one of the principal concerns of the Second Vatican Council. Christ the Lord founded one Church and one Church only. However, many Christian communions present themselves to men as the true inheritors of Jesus Christ; all indeed profess to be followers of the Lord but differ in mind and go their different ways, as if Christ Himself were divided.(1) Such division openly contradicts the will of Christ, scandalizes the world, and damages the holy cause of preaching the Gospel to every creature.
But the Lord of Ages wisely and patiently follows out the plan of grace on our behalf, sinners that we are. In recent times more than ever before, He has been rousing divided Christians to remorse over their divisions and to a longing for unity. Everywhere large numbers have felt the impulse of this grace, and among our separated brethren also there increases from day to day the movement, fostered by the grace of the Holy Spirit, for the restoration of unity among all Christians. This movement toward unity is called "ecumenical." Those belong to it who invoke the Triune God and confess Jesus as Lord and Savior, doing this not merely as individuals but also as corporate bodies. For almost everyone regards the body in which he has heard the Gospel as his Church and indeed, God's Church. All however, though in different ways, long for the one visible Church of God, a Church truly universal and set forth into the world that the world may be converted to the Gospel and so be saved, to the glory of God. Does anyone out there care to comment or agree with the summation from Pope Benedict XVI and the College of Cardinals. For myself I agree entirely with the Catholic position that protestants give scandal to the Catholic church by presenting themselves as true inheritors of the Body and Blood of Christ.
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Post by darwin on Jun 20, 2008 17:09:35 GMT
Are you for real? Protestants are Catholics, they just had a couple of different opinions about the church and protested about them (clue is in the name there). Nearly all of the points that were protested have at this stage been adopted by the catholic church. So pretty much what your are saying is that Protestants (and by association Catholics) are causing scandal to the church. Maybe I'm wrong here but I thought both sects were Christian and as a result both would or would not be the 'true inheritors of the Body and Blood of Christ'.
Anyway the above is immaterial, the question here is what you are doing on an Irish catholic site trying to incite an argument that you know nothing about. Unlike you I, as most other users on this site have, grew up in a land that was and still is divided by the evils of religion. I was born into a Protestant family in the South and as such I have first hand experience of ignorant and bigoted religious people who judged based on religious labels. But at least when people over here were taking sides it was generally down to republican or loyalist views, unfortunately religion was mixed in but really had nothing to do with it.
You on the other hand sound like a totally nutter. I've read some other posts and it seems you just like to quote other people and make ridiculous and borderline fanatical comments. Ok you are free to do as you please but I'd urge other users on this site to speak out if they feel that they are being tarnished by the extremists views of this user.
And just so you know, I'm not a protestant or a catholic, I don’t feel the need to believe in anything that is solely based on faith. However I'm not posting here just to put across my views on religion, I'm posting because a catholic friend of mine sent me a link to this topic. He is unfortunately too shackled by his own beliefs to post a comment about this or any other topic where he may appear to be 'breaking ranks' simply because he has a different and much saner opinion.
To me this is the biggest problem with all religions, that they feel they must follow others and are denied their own free will. Maybe muslin terrorists wouldn't exist if the suicide boomers were able to say, "hang on a minute, this is pretty messed up, I'm not wrapping explosives around myself. See you later boy's, I'm off to try Buddhism". Or Christian terrorists won't exist if the kids being shipped out to invade other countries went "Hang on a minute, I don’t hate these Muslins just because they have different ideas to me, in fact I read the Koran and it makes a lot more sense then the Bible and I haven't heard of any Muslin child sex scandals, maybe they're on to something". Or ultimately if everyone could say "Hang on a minute, I'm just me, I'm not this label or that label and neither is anyone else, we're all just people. Hey this thinking for myself is pretty cool, now I'm free to make up my own mind".
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Post by guillaume on Jun 20, 2008 23:40:38 GMT
Are you for real? Protestants are Catholics, they just had a couple of different opinions about the church and protested about them (clue is in the name there). Nearly all of the points that were protested have at this stage been adopted by the catholic church. So pretty much what your are saying is that Protestants (and by association Catholics) are causing scandal to the church. Maybe I'm wrong here but I thought both sects were Christian and as a result both would or would not be the 'true inheritors of the Body and Blood of Christ'. Anyway the above is immaterial, the question here is what you are doing on an Irish catholic site trying to incite an argument that you know nothing about. Unlike you I, as most other users on this site have, grew up in a land that was and still is divided by the evils of religion. I was born into a Protestant family in the South and as such I have first hand experience of ignorant and bigoted religious people who judged based on religious labels. But at least when people over here were taking sides it was generally down to republican or loyalist views, unfortunately religion was mixed in but really had nothing to do with it. You on the other hand sound like a totally nutter. I've read some other posts and it seems you just like to quote other people and make ridiculous and borderline fanatical comments. Ok you are free to do as you please but I'd urge other users on this site to speak out if they feel that they are being tarnished by the extremists views of this user. And just so you know, I'm not a protestant or a catholic, I don’t feel the need to believe in anything that is solely based on faith. However I'm not posting here just to put across my views on religion, I'm posting because a catholic friend of mine sent me a link to this topic. He is unfortunately too shackled by his own beliefs to post a comment about this or any other topic where he may appear to be 'breaking ranks' simply because he has a different and much saner opinion. To me this is the biggest problem with all religions, that they feel they must follow others and are denied their own free will. Maybe muslin terrorists wouldn't exist if the suicide boomers were able to say, "hang on a minute, this is pretty messed up, I'm not wrapping explosives around myself. See you later boy's, I'm off to try Buddhism". Or Christian terrorists won't exist if the kids being shipped out to invade other countries went "Hang on a minute, I don’t hate these Muslins just because they have different ideas to me, in fact I read the Koran and it makes a lot more sense then the Bible and I haven't heard of any Muslin child sex scandals, maybe they're on to something". Or ultimately if everyone could say "Hang on a minute, I'm just me, I'm not this label or that label and neither is anyone else, we're all just people. Hey this thinking for myself is pretty cool, now I'm free to make up my own mind". This is a Catholic Forum where Catholicism is a prime subject, in nearly every Threads. Royal.. is posting a Text written by the Vatican regarding the Protestantism. In a Catholic Forum there is nothing wrong about it. However, your response is quite pathetic. First of all, your nickname "means" a lot regarding your faith and point of view about Catholicism. Second you are already over-agressive and this is only your first post. "protestants" ARE NOT catholics ! Protestants sects decided years ago to fall from Mother Church Nest, to leave the Vatican Authority and abandon the true and only vicar of Jesus, the Pope. Protestant have little faith and respect for the Virgin Mary, Mother of God and the Church, refuge of sinners, queen of saints and angels. Protestant don't believe in the Sacrifice of the Mass. Their "service" is only a memorial and symbol. Not a True Sign in which Jesus really renew his Sacrifice on the Cross. Protestants don't believe in the Sacraments of confessions, Protestants don't pray Mary, the Rosary, the Saints. They only believe in Jesus and the Bible. Not in the Tradition and holy interpretation of Mother Church and the Fathers of the Church. Protestants are not catholics. And they are wrong. To be honest, unless you improve sightly your contribution regarding Catholicism, and even the Faith in God in general, I doubt your participation here will bring any interest whatsoever.
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Post by royalosiodhachain on Jun 20, 2008 23:43:52 GMT
Are you for real? Protestants are Catholics, they just had a couple of different opinions about the church and protested about them (clue is in the name there). Nearly all of the points that were protested have at this stage been adopted by the catholic church. So pretty much what your are saying is that Protestants (and by association Catholics) are causing scandal to the church. Maybe I'm wrong here but I thought both sects were Christian and as a result both would or would not be the 'true inheritors of the Body and Blood of Christ'. Anyway the above is immaterial, the question here is what you are doing on an Irish catholic site trying to incite an argument that you know nothing about. Unlike you I, as most other users on this site have, grew up in a land that was and still is divided by the evils of religion. I was born into a Protestant family in the South and as such I have first hand experience of ignorant and bigoted religious people who judged based on religious labels. But at least when people over here were taking sides it was generally down to republican or loyalist views, unfortunately religion was mixed in but really had nothing to do with it. You on the other hand sound like a totally nutter. I've read some other posts and it seems you just like to quote other people and make ridiculous and borderline fanatical comments. Ok you are free to do as you please but I'd urge other users on this site to speak out if they feel that they are being tarnished by the extremists views of this user. And just so you know, I'm not a protestant or a catholic, I don’t feel the need to believe in anything that is solely based on faith. However I'm not posting here just to put across my views on religion, I'm posting because a catholic friend of mine sent me a link to this topic. He is unfortunately too shackled by his own beliefs to post a comment about this or any other topic where he may appear to be 'breaking ranks' simply because he has a different and much saner opinion. To me this is the biggest problem with all religions, that they feel they must follow others and are denied their own free will. Maybe muslin terrorists wouldn't exist if the suicide boomers were able to say, "hang on a minute, this is pretty messed up, I'm not wrapping explosives around myself. See you later boy's, I'm off to try Buddhism". Or Christian terrorists won't exist if the kids being shipped out to invade other countries went "Hang on a minute, I don’t hate these Muslins just because they have different ideas to me, in fact I read the Koran and it makes a lot more sense then the Bible and I haven't heard of any Muslin child sex scandals, maybe they're on to something". Or ultimately if everyone could say "Hang on a minute, I'm just me, I'm not this label or that label and neither is anyone else, we're all just people. Hey this thinking for myself is pretty cool, now I'm free to make up my own mind". Darwin, So essentially what you're saying as I read into it is that you believe in moral relativism as opposed to firm morals. So that leaves you able to change your morality at will from either good to bad and still consider yourself right with God.
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Post by royalosiodhachain on Jun 20, 2008 23:47:30 GMT
Are you for real? Protestants are Catholics, they just had a couple of different opinions about the church and protested about them (clue is in the name there). Nearly all of the points that were protested have at this stage been adopted by the catholic church. So pretty much what your are saying is that Protestants (and by association Catholics) are causing scandal to the church. Maybe I'm wrong here but I thought both sects were Christian and as a result both would or would not be the 'true inheritors of the Body and Blood of Christ'. Anyway the above is immaterial, the question here is what you are doing on an Irish catholic site trying to incite an argument that you know nothing about. Unlike you I, as most other users on this site have, grew up in a land that was and still is divided by the evils of religion. I was born into a Protestant family in the South and as such I have first hand experience of ignorant and bigoted religious people who judged based on religious labels. But at least when people over here were taking sides it was generally down to republican or loyalist views, unfortunately religion was mixed in but really had nothing to do with it. You on the other hand sound like a totally nutter. I've read some other posts and it seems you just like to quote other people and make ridiculous and borderline fanatical comments. Ok you are free to do as you please but I'd urge other users on this site to speak out if they feel that they are being tarnished by the extremists views of this user. And just so you know, I'm not a protestant or a catholic, I don’t feel the need to believe in anything that is solely based on faith. However I'm not posting here just to put across my views on religion, I'm posting because a catholic friend of mine sent me a link to this topic. He is unfortunately too shackled by his own beliefs to post a comment about this or any other topic where he may appear to be 'breaking ranks' simply because he has a different and much saner opinion. To me this is the biggest problem with all religions, that they feel they must follow others and are denied their own free will. Maybe muslin terrorists wouldn't exist if the suicide boomers were able to say, "hang on a minute, this is pretty messed up, I'm not wrapping explosives around myself. See you later boy's, I'm off to try Buddhism". Or Christian terrorists won't exist if the kids being shipped out to invade other countries went "Hang on a minute, I don’t hate these Muslins just because they have different ideas to me, in fact I read the Koran and it makes a lot more sense then the Bible and I haven't heard of any Muslin child sex scandals, maybe they're on to something". Or ultimately if everyone could say "Hang on a minute, I'm just me, I'm not this label or that label and neither is anyone else, we're all just people. Hey this thinking for myself is pretty cool, now I'm free to make up my own mind". This is a Forum Catholic where Catholicism is a prime subject, in nearly every Threads. Royal.. is posting a Text written by the Vatican regarding the Protestantism. In a Catholic Forum there is nothing wrong about it. However, your response is quite pathetic. First of all, your nickname "means" a lot regarding your faith and point of view about Catholicism. Second you are already over-agressive and this is only your first post. "protestants" ARE NOT catholics ! Protestants sects decided years ago to fall from Mother Church Nest, to leave the Vatican Authority and abandon the true and only vicar of Jesus, the Pope. Protestant have little faith and respect for the Virgin Mary, Mother of God and the Church, refuge of sinners, queen of saints and angels. Protestant don't believe in the Sacrifice of the Mass. Their "service" is only a memorial and symbol. Not a True Sign in which Jesus really renew his Sacrifice on the Cross. Protestants don't believe in the Sacraments of confessions, Protestants don't pray Mary, the Rosary, the Saints. They only believe in Jesus and the Bible. Not in the Tradition and holy interpretation of Mother Church and the Fathers of the Church. Protestants are not catholics. And they are wrong. To be honest, unless you improve sightly your contribution regarding Catholicism, and even the Faith in God in general, I doubt your participation here will bring any interest whatsoever. guillaume, Every word you wrote is the truth. God bless you in the Holy Name of Jesus.
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Post by royalosiodhachain on Jun 22, 2008 4:55:50 GMT
Maybe I'm wrong here but I thought both sects were Christian and as a result both would or would not be the 'true inheritors of the Body and Blood of Christ'.
Yes, you are wrong. Protestants claim to be Christian while lacking the grace of the sacraments including the Body and Blood of Christ formed in the Eucharist, thus reducing their worship to merely a community prayer service invoking the name of Jesus Christ. Protestants in general baptize using the Trinitarian formula although not all protestants use that formula. Catholics practice all 7 Sacraments instituted by Christ including the Eucharist which is the authentic Body and Blood of Christ.
Anyway the above is immaterial, the question here is what you are doing on an Irish catholic site trying to incite an argument that you know nothing about.
Wrong again, I grew up in the USA which is 60% protestant, 25% Catholic and 15% aetheist and other religions. I am well aware, even moreso than the Irish the devastating effect of discord created by the lack of unity in Christ. Furthermore the document on ecuminism that I posted has been my primary focus for the past 20 years and I have made tremendous progress in that one aspect alone. I am a victim of the Irish Catholic/protestant wars as my grandfather fled Ireland for freedom from persecution at the hands of protestants toward the USA where he could worship in the Catholic church freely.
And just so you know, I'm not a protestant or a catholic, I don’t feel the need to believe in anything that is solely based on faith.
What you are describing is the irreligous view termed moral relativism which reasons that you can do anything either good or bad and still be right with God.
To me this is the biggest problem with all religions, that they feel they must follow others and are denied their own free will.
Wrong again, the greatest strength of all religions is that they encourage the denial of free will in favor of moral behavior which benefits all mankind and the religious as well.
Maybe muslin terrorists wouldn't exist if the suicide boomers were able to say, "hang on a minute, this is pretty messed up, I'm not wrapping explosives around myself. See you later boy's, I'm off to try Buddhism".
Wrong again, the Muslim religious authorities have already determined that terrorists do not practice the religion of Muslim, they practice terrorism. There is nothing in the Muslim religious doctrine that calls for violence.
Or Christian terrorists won't exist if the kids being shipped out to invade other countries went
Wrong again, your use of the words in sequence "Christian terrorists" is an oxymoron. There is nothing in Catholic doctrine that calls for violence. As I already informed you terrorists promote terrorism.
Hey this thinking for myself is pretty cool, now I'm free to make up my own mind
Freely choosing a religious belief is a prerequisite in any religion. If you are forced into a religious habit, that does not make you Holy, it makes you rebellious. I will recommend that you use your "free will" to educate yourself more extensively in all religions, then make your choice. You have already made a choice of sorts for moral relativism which is in fact a form of religious belief.
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Post by guillaume on Jun 22, 2008 22:47:58 GMT
For too long the CC (Catholic Church) had been involved with protestantism. Still nowadays, some Catholics priests are involved with the protestants. Doing so, they are losing their faith. and Our faith. Of course, we must "love our enemies". But it doesn't mean to lose our great and beautifully faith in order to marry and/or approve a weak and wrong faith. In Ireland, the protestant faith comes from the British. They built beautiful Churches around the country. But the Truth is not spread via those buildings. Fortunately Ireland managed to keep the Truth. Until now. Protestants are wrong, wrong and more wrong. They may managed to build lovely churches on earth. But their wrong faith will build their own perdition.
It is a big mistake "to love" the protestants. Pope B16 is trying to sort out this insanity. He is just trying to get the CC to the Reality. Don't forget that the protestants despise us. Hate us. No way for Ecumenism . They showed they do not care. It is better to help ourself within the CC.
Protestants are not our friends.
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Post by royalosiodhachain on Jun 23, 2008 2:10:05 GMT
For too long the CC (Catholic Church) had been involved with protestantism. Still nowadays, some Catholics priests are involved with the protestants. Doing so, they are losing their faith. and Our faith. Of course, we must "love our enemies". But it doesn't mean to lose our great and beautifully faith in order to marry and/or approve a weak and wrong faith. In Ireland, the protestant faith comes from the British. They built beautiful Churches around the country. But the Truth is not spread via those buildings. Fortunately Ireland managed to keep the Truth. Until now. Protestants are wrong, wrong and more wrong. They may managed to build lovely churches on earth. But their wrong faith will build their own perdition. It is a big mistake "to love" the protestants. Pope B16 is trying to sort out this insanity. He is just trying to get the CC to the Reality. Don't forget that the protestants despise us. Hate us. No way for Ecumenism . They showed they do not care. It is better to help ourself within the CC. Protestants are not our friends. Willy, You are altogether correct. That is why the Vatican document on ecuminism is citing the false pretense of the protestants as presenting themselves as inheritors of the Body and Blood of Christ. There is only one Christian church and that is Catholic. It is in my opinion extremely difficult to discuss any of this doctrine with a protestant as they deny it completely. Rather as the document implies, prayer is the most definitive answer "that they may all be one", further, the document explains that ecuminism is the day to day purpose of the Catholic church albeit a difficult task and that primarily the currently considered doctrines are of the Orthodox faith which practice in nearly identical liturgy to Catholic liturgy with the obstacle being acceptance of the Pope as the Vicar of Christ and Chief Shepherd. When the Pope's authority is denied, everyone loses and especially the protestants. I met a female protestant minister while I worked on contract at a protestant church doing repairs who eventually entered the Catholic church because she was enamoured with Pope John Paul 11 and especially admired the doctrine of the Blessed Mother of Christ, Mary. She was one of few and far between insofar as problematic protestants are concerned. She actually became Catholic at the protest of her husband whom was also a protestant minister. Your view is correct that there is a great deal of hatred vented toward the Catholic faith from the protestants and so eventually, prayer is the ultimate answer so that Christ Himself supernaturally causes the change of heart in the protestant being as reason and communication is nearly futile.
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Post by guillaume on Jun 23, 2008 12:33:42 GMT
I know than in the States you suffer of the protestants influence. I am thinking about the tele-evangeliss right now. Making BIG money in the name of the Lord ! Wow... How come those guys will go to heaven ? Did they read the Bible, as they always reference, "it is easier for a camel..." ? Poverty is a virtue and nearly a new commandement. Yes, our Lord want us to be poor, to be free from the temptations of the earthly world. Protestants think otherwise. They take the Bible, and chose whatever it is good for them and reject whatever they do not like. Some catholics do the same though. Especially rich catholics. Accumulating richness in this world will be useless. Win the Lotto ! Win 3 millions euros or dollars. But at the end, in your coffin, while your body will be eaten by worms, when you will be dead what your 3 millions euros will help ? How come the protestants being so blind ? Unfortunatly, the praise of Money had touched Ireland big time. "Prosperity" was the main goal of the Fiane Fail Party, the main Party in Ireland. Now their leader, the ex-irish-prime-minister, Berty, is facing a human judgement at the Tribunal and had to show his P45 to his own governement. (P45 is the official tax paper to be shown when you quit a job). I don't say that Ireland must be back to poverty in order to be back to real Spirituality. BUT, Ireland must manage in a Christian way, the wealth she had accumulated...
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Post by royalosiodhachain on Jun 23, 2008 23:22:09 GMT
I know than in the States you suffer of the protestants influence. I am thinking about the tele-evangeliss right now. Making BIG money in the name of the Lord ! Wow... How come those guys will go to heaven ? Did they read the Bible, as they always reference, "it is easier for a camel..." ? Poverty is a virtue and nearly a new commandement. Willy, It is true what you say. The protestants pervert the message of Christ and preach a doctrine of financial wealth and physical health whereas the Catholic doctrine preaches a doctrine of spiritual wealth and spiritual health which is true to the command of Christ, "Store up your treasure in heaven" and "Those who obey my commands will attain heaven" The greatest fault of the protestant preachers is leading others astray from the true meaning of Scriptural intent. This was the fault of Martin Luther and is the fault of all other protestants who pervert the meaning of the Scriptures. That is why what they are doing is scandalous to Christianity. Yes, our Lord want us to be poor, to be free from the temptations of the earthly world. Protestants think otherwise. They take the Bible, and chose whatever it is good for them and reject whatever they do not like. This is exactly where Martin Luther broke Holy Communion with the Catholic church. He misinterpreted the Holy Scriptures as all protestants do. Their doctrine is riddled with faults. Some catholics do the same though. Especially rich catholics. Accumulating richness in this world will be useless. Win the Lotto ! Win 3 millions euros or dollars. But at the end, in your coffin, while your body will be eaten by worms, when you will be dead what your 3 millions euros will help ?This is why Pope John Paul 11 called for Catholic's to be authentic in thier worship meaning that true Christians (Catholic's) redistribute wealth as the early Christians did. The Catholic's of today need to practice the same redistribution of wealth in order to prove themselves true Christians. All gave the Apostles what they had and it was redistributed to all according to their needs. How come the protestants being so blind ?The protestants can be so blind because as Christ has told us, "No one can come to the Father except through the Son, and no one can come to the Son unless the Father wills it". The protestants are not called to Christ and so that is why they pervert His word and preach a false doctrine to lead men away from Christ. As Catholic doctrine has always declared, "Outside the church there is no means to Salvation". Unfortunatly, the praise of Money had touched Ireland big time. "Prosperity" was the main goal of the Fiane Fail Party, the main Party in Ireland. Now their leader, the ex-irish-prime-minister, Berty, is facing a human judgement at the Tribunal and had to show his P45 to his own governement. (P45 is the official tax paper to be shown when you quit a job). I don't say that Ireland must be back to poverty in order to be back to real Spirituality. BUT, Ireland must manage in a Christian way, the wealth she had accumulated... [/quote][/i] Wealth is not an unmanageable commodity, it simply needs to be redistributed fairly and that is what the Government of Ireland is failing in, they are not redistributing that wealth toward charity. The Vatican has recently released a newer documentation that identifies governments as instruments of charity (or so they should be) The entire purpose for having a government is to provide for the needs of the populace in a fair and just manner, practicing charity toward their fellow countrymen. When that charity is missing, the government you have is proven guilty of crime against humanity. Christ will judge that government guilty of the crimes they perpetuate against their countrymen, they will not escape as there is nowhere to escape to. Christ is the judge of all mankind. All forms of government need to be exhorted by Catholic's to be charitable toward their countrymen in the form of either letters to representatives or by attendance and vocal complaint in government legislative, judicial and executive sessions. I recently wrote to President Bush who is considering a conversion to the Catholic faith to congratulate him and encourage him to follow the truth to charity and justice for the American people, however his war against foreign peoples is to be abhorred for the cost to humanity in the loss of lives and material wealth that should rather be redistributed to all Americans rather than drain our nation of it's resources to fight a never ending war. He should receive the letter today and I am hoping he will respond to me and if not, at least I got two licks in there to let him know I dont agree with him on the war and one lick in there to let him know he would benefit personally as well as our nation for him to become Catholic. Who knows what a letter will do? I am writing one to you as well and you to me and I must say your words written resonate within me as though I were talking to my grandfather himself.
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Post by royalosiodhachain on Jun 24, 2008 0:03:49 GMT
Protestants are not our friends. [/quote][/i]
Willy, This is true, protestants are not called to Christ in the Eucharist, so they are lacking the Body and Blood of Christ which leaves them with "No life in them" as Christ has said, "Unless you eat my flesh and drink my blood, you have no life in you" The protestants do not eat and drink the Body and Blood of Christ in the Eucharist. However, if Catholic's are guilty of one fault, it may be the omission of exhortation. Many of the early Popes said this of Catholic's, that they do not exhort one another to faith and I beleive many Catholic's do not exhort protestants to tell the truth.
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Post by Askel McThurkill on Jun 24, 2008 14:06:42 GMT
The preamble of the Irish Constitution mentions justice and charity, but this is more evident in the breach than in the observance. The same may be said of the aspiration in the Proclamation of the Irish Republic to 'cherish all the children of the nation equally'.
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Post by Harris on Nov 4, 2008 10:29:13 GMT
Wow. I just came across this thread whilst browsing. Some angry people on here.
Was royalosiodhachain removed from this site?
Does anyone know has he come back to the site reincarnated as another poster?
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Post by hibernicus on Nov 4, 2008 23:55:51 GMT
I think Guillaume and Royalosiodchain are sorely lacking in charity towards Protestants. They are (mostly) Christians and I can think of quite a few Protestants who are more outspoken on such issues as abortion than many so-called Catholics. We ought to try to work with them on issues of common concern where possible, not denounce them all indiscriminately; though of course we ought not to deny our doctrinal differences. Darwin pretty much disqualifies himself from serious consideration when he declares "Protestants are Catholics". We have certain common beliefs but denying that there are any significant differences because we all look the same to an uninterested atheist is like saying "Jews are really Christians" or "Buddhists are really Hindus" (or "Trotskyites are really social democrats" because they look the same to an Ayn Randian libertarian!) Say Hi to Senator Joe McCarthy - that's exactly his sort of logic...
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Post by hibernicus on Nov 5, 2008 0:09:00 GMT
By the way, how is it that though we have quite a few atheist visitors we don't seem to get Evangelical Protestants here (or liberal Catholics for that matter)? Incidentally, Darwin, it wasn't until I went to live in a Protestant-majority region that I realised how different Protestantism is from Catholicism (in a predominantly Catholic culture it's easy to take for granted that certain beliefs and practices are universal when in fact they're specifically Catholic) but I still get on OK with Protestants. We can recognise our differences without automatically launching wars of religion -OK?
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