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Seminarys
Aug 3, 2015 12:30:51 GMT
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Post by castlelic on Aug 3, 2015 12:30:51 GMT
Can anyone suggest some good seminaries in the states if anyone has any connections or insight . I can't ask my vocations offer because although he is a gentleman he is a useless director and unless you suggest it they will ship you of to maligned maynooth
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Post by Deleted on Aug 3, 2015 12:37:17 GMT
Maolsheachlann might be able to help you out. He probably has the best US connection of anyone else here.
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Post by maolsheachlann on Aug 3, 2015 12:43:37 GMT
That may or may not be so, but I don't know anything about American seminaries, I'm afraid!
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Post by Young Ireland on Aug 3, 2015 16:20:01 GMT
The only way I think that you will be able to avoid Maynooth would be to try to apply to the FSSP in Denton, NB if you're a trad and want to go that direction. I'm not sure that you would be allowed to attend seminary in the States, and in fact bringing it up could trigger the question "what's wrong with Maynooth?" and if you answer the wrong way, they'll probably say that you're not a suitable candidate for ordination.
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Post by castlelic on Aug 5, 2015 0:07:36 GMT
The only way I think that you will be able to avoid Maynooth would be to try to apply to the FSSP in Denton, NB if you're a trad and want to go that direction. I'm not sure that you would be allowed to attend seminary in the States, and in fact bringing it up could trigger the question "what's wrong with Maynooth?" and if you answer the wrong way, they'll probably say that you're not a suitable candidate for ordination. I've already been accepted and I said I wouldn't go to maynooth . I deferred it till next September but they are aware that I'm not happy to be sent there . They aren't daft anyhow . Most people know the type of formation that's been given in there so they didn't seem shocked when I mentioned it . What is the FSSP prey tell !!! ? (Thanks for info)
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Post by Young Ireland on Aug 5, 2015 12:43:01 GMT
The only way I think that you will be able to avoid Maynooth would be to try to apply to the FSSP in Denton, NB if you're a trad and want to go that direction. I'm not sure that you would be allowed to attend seminary in the States, and in fact bringing it up could trigger the question "what's wrong with Maynooth?" and if you answer the wrong way, they'll probably say that you're not a suitable candidate for ordination. I've already been accepted and I said I wouldn't go to maynooth . I deferred it till next September but they are aware that I'm not happy to be sent there . They aren't daft anyhow . Most people know the type of formation that's been given in there so they didn't seem shocked when I mentioned it . What is the FSSP prey tell !!! ? (Thanks for info) By FSSP I mean the Priestly Fraternity of St. Peter. If you've been accepted then that's a different story, though I can't imagine that it will be easy to get transferred out of Maynooth.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Aug 7, 2015 8:13:23 GMT
If anyone can manage studying in either French or German, I suggest going to the FSSP in Wigratzbad rather than Denton. It's not that much of an ask; if you go to the Pontifical Irish College in Rome, you would be looking at studying in Italian in the Gregorian or Lateran. Only the Angelicum and Beda offer courses in English and the Beda is only for late vocations.
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Post by hibernicus on Oct 27, 2015 20:08:58 GMT
An interesting discussion of the problems facing seminaries and theological colleges (Protestant as well as Catholic) in contemporary America and what might or might not be done about them: www.theamericanconservative.com/dreher/seminaries-post-christian-america/This comment reflects the sort of thing a lot of people worry about: EXTRACT Rick says: October 27, 2015 at 11:37 am I was in a Catholic college seminary many years ago, but I think many of these points are still valid: I lost my faith in Theology classes. Scripture was presented as prescientific myth and fable. Deconstructive Theory applied to theology was very much in vogue. My children, who went to a Catholic high school, got a lot of the same deconstructive analysis of scripture. They view the faith as purely as myth and fable and practice nothing now. The teachers who were most destructive to their faith were priests and sisters who spent time talking about the historical Jesus, Q, and whether miracles really happened. One teacher tried to teach lectio divina but handed out complex philosophical works and expected college level analysis of the work. Good preparation for college but not lectio divina. The traditional morality of the Church in the seminary was not taught outside of the lens that it is oppressive psychologically to all people, but especially oppressive to women and gay men and women. The book I read in my morality class was Human Sexuality: New Directions in American Catholic Thought. Prayer was very didactic and logical. Things like devotions (holy hours, the rosary, benediction) were discouraged. They were things only ignorant country people did. As recently as five years ago during a sermon my mother’s pastor mocked people who say the rosary and light candles in front of statues. Treating my faith academically only killed it. It only began to thrive again after I left the seminary and got back to my backward county ways: saying the rosary, going to confession, and reading some of the old devotional material that was laughed out of the seminary. My experience with many priests is that they are ashamed of orthodoxy and traditional piety. They undercut it but fail to replace it with anything except pop psychology and social action. I guess I’m saying that many priest seem to be Moral Therapeutic Deists–and that they do not want to see orthodox Christianity survive. END OF EXTRACT Any thoughts/comments on this?
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Post by Young Ireland on Dec 10, 2017 16:21:08 GMT
How did you get on castlelic?
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Post by hibernicus on Jun 18, 2020 1:04:53 GMT
From a thread about an unrelated subject (two lay workers pulling a tasteless, though probably well-meant, stunt with a monstrance to show the presence of God in everyday life) on Fr Zuhlsdorf's blog: wdtprs.com/2020/06/how-bad-is-the-state-of-the-catholic-faith-in-germany/EXTRACT Public Savant says: 17 June 2020 at 1:11 PM That’s nothing. I was in a certain Irish seminary in the late 1990s. In my last year there our annual retreat was conducted by a priest and a sister from a retreat house. Every year the annual retreat concluded with a Holy Hour. They refused to allow this so negotiations opened … Finally they gave in and allowed us our Holy Hour on the condition that it was not held in the chapel … possibly thinking that we wouldn’t agree to that. The Holy hour was eventually held in the non-smoking TV room. The TV was removed from its perch and the monstrance with the Blessed Sacrament was put in its place. Irish seminary TV rooms back then were nothing like their US counterparts. It was a hard floor and uncomfortable seating with harsh lights. We had our Holy Hour but it was the most unusual I’ve ever ever witnessed. END OF EXTRACT
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Post by hibernicus on Jun 20, 2020 19:17:11 GMT
I've just picked up this news story. The Irish College in Rome will no longer take seminarians as the bishops have decided to focus on Maynooth. Whatever about the Irish College, and what little I hear is mixed, putting all the eggs in the Maynooth basket is a classic example of rewarding failure. The suggestion, whether true or false, that this may not be unrelated to rising Roman real estate prices won't help (similar rumours are circulating about prospective church closures in Britain, BTW). I visited the former Irish College in Leuven a few years ago. It was sad to see the dry holy water fonts still embedded in the wall beside the door of what was now a (very cluttered) office but still had stained glass windows.. www.irishcatholic.com/end-of-era-as-romes-irish-college-shuts-as-seminary-after-nearly-400-yearsfor-now/
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Post by Askel McThurkill on Jun 22, 2020 9:04:51 GMT
I always react when I hear: the Irish College. I know the speaker is referring to the Pontifical Irish College, which is the seminary in Rome for training priests for Irish dioceses primarily (not exclusively). But until quite recently, this was one of four Irish colleges in Rome.
St Patrick's College, Rome was the Irish Augustinian province's seminary. This included St Patrick's Church in Rome which used to be the Irish national church in Rome. The Irish Augustinian province have given this to the Paulists, so St Patrick's is now the US national church in Rome (it was Santa Susanna). I don't if the Irish Augustinians retain ownership. The issue of the seminary in Rome is not a problem for the Augustinians, as the Irish province were under pressure for some time to send their students to St Monica's College which is on Vatican territory. I think the principal argument against this was that the staff in St Monica's were drawn from the Augustinianum, which is a specialist Patristic institute and universities such as the Gregorian (SJ) and the Angelicum (OP) provide better general theology. Students in St Patrick's usually attended the Greg; the main argument for going to the Angelicum was that it offered courses in English. Mature students, late vocations, usually opted for the Beda. For this reason, losing St Patrick's as the Irish national church is a much bigger deal.
St Clement's, San Clemente, is the Irish Dominican church and college in Rome. Dominican students invariably go to the Angelicum. It has been some time since the Irish Dominican province have had students for the priesthood there, but it does send post graduate priests there. It is not too long ago that the Irish Dominicans were also responsible for the Irish College in Lisbon.
St Isidore's is the Irish Franciscan college, and now the Irish national church. Franciscans in Rome also would tend to go to the Gregorian. But it's all academic as there are few Franciscan vocations. And heaven knows for how long San Isidore will be in Irish hands.
With regard to shutting the Pontifical Irish College, right beside the Lateran University (most of the students went here, though others went to the Gregorian and Angelicum - the Greg is the most prestigious), this is part of a long process of experimentation by the Irish bishops - regionalisation first, then centralisation. I think they probably think they can keep a closer eye on Maynooth. But the symbolic message is very bad.
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Post by Beinidict Ó Niaidh on Jun 22, 2020 9:18:32 GMT
I found this very sad commentary on the disappearance of the Irish College in Salamanca, especially about the last years of it's existence: last rector. I understand Father McCabe, when in his 90s, was asked to come to make an address in Maynooth on the occasion of the visit of King Juan Carlos and Queen Sophia to the college and the king remarked on the excellence of his Spanish. Another great link lost.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Jun 22, 2020 9:36:49 GMT
I found this very sad commentary on the disappearance of the Irish College in Salamanca, especially about the last years of it's existence: last rector. I understand Father McCabe, when in his 90s, was asked to come to make an address in Maynooth on the occasion of the visit of King Juan Carlos and Queen Sophia to the college and the king remarked on the excellence of his Spanish. Another great link lost. Here's a review of the book referred to: eye witness. But interesting as this story is, we ought to revert back to what's under discussion. This disappearance of the Irish Colleges in Lisbon, Paris, Salamanca and Louvain/Leuven are tragedies; as are the effective closures/disposals of St Patrick's, St Clement's and St Isidore's in Rome. But the Pontifical Irish College in Rome is of a different order entirely. Rome is the centre of the universal church and as important as the other cities are to Catholic culture, they are not the same as Rome. I regret there was never an Irish college somewhere such as Munich or Vienna (at least not in the second millennium), but we need the link with the centre, the capital if you will of the universal Church. Any religious order has the capacity to send students to Rome, without necessarily having a house for the specific Irish province there. But the Irish bishops need to maintain an institution in Rome for the education of seminarists and so ordained priests may have the facility to undertake post graduate studies. Also to have a base in Rome. Every religious order has a procurator general in Rome to represent the interests of the orders to the Holy See (and wrangle with the Curia). The Apostolic Nuncio in Dublin is the ambassador of the Holy See to the Republic of Ireland, but also the Apostolic Delegate to the Irish hierarchy (north and south - the Nuncio in London is Ambassador at the Court of St James, but only Apostolic Delegate to the English and Welsh and Scottish Hierarchies). The Irish state has its embassy to the Holy See, but the church need some analogous facility. Of course the role of the Irish College in Rome has been very interesting in the past too and worth a discussion. But as an institution, it's needed now. In a way that many of the regional seminaries are no longer necessary (though also tragic in their demise).
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Oct 10, 2021 20:52:51 GMT
As far as Ireland is concerned, seminary need only be written in the singular.
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