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Post by Askel McThurkill on Jan 24, 2024 17:44:20 GMT
In other words, the plaintiff's request is equivalent to demanding that when you change your nationality your birth certificate should be erased. And the record of your birth deleted.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Feb 20, 2024 10:49:04 GMT
OnePeterFive has its own axes to grind, but this discussion of post-Vatican II changes to German hymnody seems quite plausible: onepeterfive.com/german-hymnal-synodal-way/onepeterfive.com/germanys-synodal-way-hymnal-trojan-horse-hymns/ Two points about the discussion of changes to an individual hymn in the second article - (a) There are obvious historical reasons why a German hymnodist in the 1960s and 1970s might be wary of military metaphors. (b) To judge from the summary, the original version of the hymn might be suspected of implying that the Church here on earth is as perfect as the Church in Heaven. Sometimes I get suspicious of articles citing the author's academic qualifications though the subject under discussion is outside their specialisation. This is one of these. I do accept there is a problem with the Gotteslob. But let's first define what it is, as the author does so in such a cack-handed manner. It is the official hymnal for the dioceses of Germany, Austria, the German-speaking dioceses of Switzerland, Luxembourg, Liechtenstein, the Diocese of Bozen Brixen (Bolzano Bressanone - South Tyrol) and the German-speaking parishes in the diocese of Liege (Belgium). That alone is quite an achievement. I am not sure of the status of the Gotteslob in places like Kazakhstan where there are concentrations of German-speaking Catholics, but I suspect they use them. I am a bit surprised someone working in Heiligenkreuz has no access to a prayerbook with the St Michael Archangel prayer. It is true that the Gotteslob has watered down a lot of the older hymns, but the writer doesn't mention it still contains a lot of Latin hymns and the text of the Ordinary Form Mass in Latin. Also, the sort of hymn she is deriding may be included, but the more popular hymns in church are usually the more traditional ones, including a lot more Marian hymns than we can manage. You are right - One Peter Five has axes to grind. The German Catholic TV Channel K-TV www.k-tv.org/live-stream/ was on in the background the other day when I was at breakfast. They were just over Mass and the Rosary when they broadcast the Leonine Prayers - I think the priest voicing them was Austrian. I gather they do this every day. I found this interesting in the light of the interaction overhead. I think that we probably don't have a clue of the infrastructure of orthodox German Catholicism. EWTN broadcast in German ( www.ewtn.de/streaming/player.php ) from a Cologne base and if anything K-TV is more conservative. EWTN broadcast Mass daily in German from Cologne Cathedral, which under Cardinal Woelki is a bastion of orthodoxy in the German-speaking world (quite a turnaround largely down to the late Cardinal Meissner). K-TV broadcasts Masses from a number of churches. On Sunday mornings, it's usually a Solemn High Mass from St Peter's College, Wigratzbad, which is the seminary of the Priestly Fraternity of St Peter ( obviously EF in Latin) at 7 am GMT. They also do German Masses in pilgrimage centres in the traditional Catholic areas in Germany, Austria and Switzerland - Dettelbach in Franconia (northern Bavaria), Saarlouis in the Saarland (that's gorgeous), Wemding in central Bavaria, Altötting (the Bavarian national Marian shrine - right beside Benedict XVI's birthplace in Marktl), Semmering in Austria (in the Alps) and the Dominican convent in Davos in Switzerland (yes, the Davos where the WEF meet). These churches all have fixed altars. Sometimes Mass in from the cathedral in Freiburg im Breisgau which is the only place here with any reputation for liberalism. In regard to content, the programming on either is orthodox and devotional. On the radio, there's Radio Horeb, connected with the Radio Maria networks which broadcasts from the Bavarian/Austrian border (actually within and under the auspices of the Augsburg diocese which is another centre of conservative Catholicism in Germany). There's at least one orthodox newspaper in circulation, Tagespost. I supppose this is to give a flavour of the infrastructure with faithful Catholics in the German-speaking world have at their disposal.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Feb 23, 2024 16:52:30 GMT
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Post by hibernicus on Feb 25, 2024 21:16:06 GMT
I would think the remarkably rapid collapse of the Church in Quebec in the 60s might be another parallel, though there is more Anglophone material on Quebec. One possibility is that Quebec suggests how things might have gone in a Home Rule Ireland.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Feb 26, 2024 13:09:05 GMT
I would think the remarkably rapid collapse of the Church in Quebec in the 60s might be another parallel, though there is more Anglophone material on Quebec. One possibility is that Quebec suggests how things might have gone in a Home Rule Ireland. There are more. I am amazed at the collapse of Belgium, particularly Flanders, which was so frequently held up as a model for Ireland.
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Post by hibernicus on Mar 3, 2024 1:21:40 GMT
Part of the similarity is that Flanders industrialised quite rapidly after WW2, having been the more rural region. Wallonia's traditional heavy industry has become a rustbelt in the same period. Modern Quebec nationalism is very secular, and part of the impetus behind the Quiet Revolution was belief that the church's control of education had weakened the province's economy and hindered the ability of Francophones to compete with the traditional Anglophone business elite. Rene Levesque who founded the Parti Quebecois started out as a Liberal provincial minister who helped implement the Quiet Revolution but came to believe Quebec identity could only be fulfilled through political independence, as distinct from Pierre Trudeau's view that independence was a recipe for provincialism and chauvinism and Quebec was best accommodated in a multicultural Canada. Is Flemish nationalism selfconsciously secular in the same way?
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