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Post by hibernicus on Jul 16, 2011 20:54:38 GMT
I would like to know a bit more about this devotion - does it represent a pious section of socieety, or is it observed as a hallowed custom without always involving deeper faith (just as they say many people who take part in the cofradia processions do so as a gesture of civic patriotism without necessarily having faith). Remember Spain currently has one of the most aggressive secularist governments in Europe, and the more it makes a mess of the economy the more it tosses bones to its core vote at the Church's expense (and tries to make the opposition seem reactionary if they oppose it - which does apparently have some effect). I suspect Messrs Quinn Gilmour, Frances Fitzgerald adn Co see themselves as Irish Zapateros.
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Post by naomhadomnan on Jul 17, 2011 14:26:40 GMT
Well, the parish is run by the Franciscans. I didn't see them in the Church, but they must have been there somewhere. A friend of mine told me that they wear shirts, and that they claimed in confession that something he knows is a sin wasn't a sin, so it's ultra liberal.
Nonetheless, dozens of people were kneeling praying the Rosary, praying before St Anthony etc. Many south Americans go there, so they bring the faith with them. I guess it's a hallowed custom for many though.
Myself and a friend were having a coffee after Mass today, and we had our missals with us. A woman beside us was fascinated with them. She asked us what religion were we. She was amazed were Catholic. She said none of her family were baptised. She is from Barcelona. I know some great Spanish Catholics but that's probably just the tiny circle I move in. It is as lost as Ireland though today I think. The worst Novus Ordo Mass I've ever seen was in the south of Spain. I shudder thinking of it.
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Post by naomhadomnan on Jul 17, 2011 14:36:45 GMT
True Hibernicus. Outsiders had no rights. Rights came with honour, which could be acquired in many ways, for example through praise poetry. All crime restitution involved payment. If you were guilty of killing someone, you had to pay his family cows depending on how honourable the victim was. Chieftains had higher prices than slaves. It was quite unusual, but essentially society worked through a complex system of insurance. I don't think that's really a criticism of Brehon law though.
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Post by hibernicus on Jul 17, 2011 20:39:40 GMT
The point about the South americans is interesting _ I wonder are they equivalent to the Poles here (though the SOuth americans have historically been MUCH less effective at producing religious vocations than the Poles - or indeed than the Irish were until recently). I remember seeing reviews of a recent theatrical adaptation of Kate O'Brien's novel THE ANTE-ROOM in which the only character expressing religious belief was a Polish au pair; the adapter expressly stated in an interview that O'Brien's depiction of Catholic guilt was entirely out of place among the modern secularised Catholic bourgeoisie.
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