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Post by Young Ireland on Nov 17, 2016 18:46:03 GMT
I regret to inform everyone that Justin Barrett is back, and has started up a new party called the National Party. Details are very sketchy, but here is their manifesto for what it's worth: www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/national-party-leader-espouses-creation-of-catholic-republic-1.2870955Needless to say, I strongly oppose this movement, as all this will do is paint a target on Catholics and pro-lifers, which will only lead to our further marginalisation in our society, especially when plans are afoot to destroy what remains of the protection for the unborn. More analysis later.
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Post by maolsheachlann on Nov 17, 2016 20:19:04 GMT
The alliance of nationalism and Catholicism is always dangerous-- nationalism inevitably takes precedence. I do not think the Faith should be politicized.
I always wonder how people like Justin Barrett make their living. Who has time and money to devote to microparties that will inevitably fail?
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Post by Young Ireland on Nov 17, 2016 21:12:56 GMT
The alliance of nationalism and Catholicism is always dangerous-- nationalism inevitably takes precedence. I do not think the Faith should be politicized. I always wonder how people like Justin Barrett make their living. Who has time and money to devote to microparties that will inevitably fail? Agreed that the Faith must not be used in a tribal manner. As for how he does it, I'm not concerned too much about that as I am about this stunt exposing us to further attacks on our relgious and conscientuous freedom, as all the liberals and pro-aborts have to do is point to the National Party, and hey presto, people who might be won over to us will now be driven away. What on earth does Mr. Barrett think this will achieve? As for ourselves, all we can do is make crystal clear that we want nothing to do with his party and that it does not represent Catholics or pro-lifers.
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Post by maolsheachlann on Nov 17, 2016 21:33:32 GMT
Hopefully it will fly under most peoples' radar...
It's amazing how unreflective the Irish people are when it comes to Catholicism.
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Post by Young Ireland on Nov 17, 2016 21:34:55 GMT
Hopefully it will fly under most peoples' radar... It's amazing how unreflective the Irish people are when it comes to Catholicism. Please God.
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Post by maolsheachlann on Nov 19, 2016 11:43:55 GMT
I recently developed an interest in Ailtirí na hAiséirge, the Irish far-right party of the mid-twentieth century which, amongst other things, called for Catholic integralism. Although I don't think Catholic integralism is a runner in our modern society-- we would have to have much greater success in evangelism as a precondition to it-- and nor do I even think it necessarily desirable, I wondered how effective a Catholic integralist movement might be as a kind of ' ginger group' within Irish society. (Another objection to Catholic integralism I can think of is that Christ specifically said his kingdom was NOT of this world.) Anyway, I was interested enough to look up the newspaper of the movement, whose archives are available in the library where I work. I was very disappointed-- the focus was very much upon political nationalism, and to a lesser degree on cultural nationalism. There were barely any references to religion at all. Some polemics against indecent films and literature was as far as it went. This isn't the only example I've encountered of nationalism always taking predominance over Catholicism, when they are wedded this way, but it's the one that comes to mind. I might mention here that I no longer even consider myself a nationalist of any variety. "For here we do not have a lasting city, but we are seeking the city which is to come." (Hebrews 13:14.) (Edit a few days later: I guess I'm kidding myself when I say I'm not a nationalist. I think I will always be a nationalist. But I think sacred matters should always be clearly prioritised over secular matters.)
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Post by hibernicus on Nov 20, 2016 22:45:19 GMT
RM Douglas's book ARCHITECTS OF THE RESURRECTION, which is based on papers held by the family of the Aiseiri leader Gearoid O Cuinneagain, is the basic resource for study of that party. Hugo Hamilton's memoir THE SPECKLED PEOPLE gives an idea of what it was like to have an Ailtiri ideologue for a father. There is a strong comparison between Justin Barrett and Gearoid O Cuinneagain, given that they both operated on the assumption that they WEre heaven-sent leaders whose followers must exhibit blind obedience (because they were both influenced by the Nazi Fuehrerprinzip) and wound up inhabiting a fantasy world. If you have ever read Barrett's THE NATIONAL WAY FORWARD you will see that it is simply a collection of assertions which are not sustained by argument - you are simply expected to accept whatever he says because he says it. The book is also based on the assumption that the present system is so corrupt it must inevitably collapse, and that the only possible response is to hasten the collapse while preparing to take possession of the ruins. (O Cuinneagain, in contrast, operated on the assumption that we could create a Catholic-Gaelic utopia if only we wanted it enough, basing himself on the utopian expectations attached to Catholic corporatist social thought in the period.) This mindset is pretty well guaranteed to produce the political equivalent of a religious cult. (A cult is whatever the leader says it is, and changes whenever he changes his mind; a sect has core principles which the leader cannot change, or can only change with great difficulty. Thus the Palmarians are a cult and the Free Presbyterians are a sect.)
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Post by maolsheachlann on Nov 20, 2016 23:16:42 GMT
I listened to two interviews with Barrett on Irish radio channels (uploaded onto Youtube) and I must say he made his case fairly well. The hostility of the interviewers made me sympathise with him. He is no longer calling for a Catholic republic. He seems to be simply rebranding himself as an Irish Nigel Farage.
I haven't paid much attention to him in the past.
He has an unfortunate manner of speaking which makes me think he's highly unlikely to become an influential demagogue. He hardly has a Hitlerian or even Faragean charisma.
Complaining about the irrelevance of the Seanad, after the Irish people voted to keep it so recently, is rather stupid.
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Post by Young Ireland on Nov 20, 2016 23:20:29 GMT
I listened to two interviews with Barrett on Irish radio channels (uploaded onto Youtube) and I must say he made his case fairly well. The hostility of the interviewers made me sympathise with him. He is no longer calling for a Catholic republic. He seems to be simply rebranding himself as an Irish Nigel Farage. I haven't paid much attention to him in the past. He has an unfortunate manner of speaking which makes me think he's highly unlikely to become an influential demagogue. He hardly has a Hitlerian or even Faragean charisma. Complaining about the irrelevance of the Seanad, after the Irish people voted to keep it so recently, is rather stupid. He may have rebranded himself, but neither has he distanced himself from his former views. Given the platform he is campaigning on, it is fair to say that he still holds them, but is keeping quiet about it.
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Post by maolsheachlann on Nov 20, 2016 23:23:51 GMT
I'm glad he's no longer dragging Catholicism into it anyway.
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Post by hibernicus on Nov 27, 2016 20:18:55 GMT
Fr Denis Fahey's MARIA DUCE were actually quite a good example of theocrats who put religion first with politics as a figleaf, in contrast to the Ailtiri who were the other way round. Their problem was that they didn't really understand religion and reduced it to a series of formulae about how to create heaven on earth by suppressing Jews and having an established church, without any concern about how such measures had worked out in practice. Fahey basically believed he had grasped the essence of Catholicism and that every Catholic was obliged to co-operate with him without quEstioning or criticising him in any way. It is a great reproach to the IRish Church that he wasn't given the same treatment as Fr Feeney, who was actually more intellectually interesting in many ways.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Nov 28, 2016 9:09:56 GMT
Anyone who attempted to read The National Way Forward! found it very heavy going. Not because of the complexity of the thought but because it is poorly written by someone who envisages a dictatorship headed by himself. But the author moved in very narrow circles so it was easy for him to develop the sense of being anointed by God.
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Post by maolsheachlann on Dec 17, 2018 20:32:39 GMT
Interesting that John Waters has come out in support of Justin Barrett-- at least quoting him approvingly in this interview, and speaking positively of him elsewhere. www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEnOwn4v2YkI cannot see the National Party making any headway-- Irish people tend not to go for that kind of strident rhetoric. But ideas which were previously taboo in Ireland now seem to be increasingly mainstreamed.
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Post by Young Ireland on Dec 17, 2018 20:56:21 GMT
Interesting that John Waters has come out in support of Justin Barrett-- at least quoting him approvingly in this interview, and speaking positively of him elsewhere. www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEnOwn4v2YkI cannot see the National Party making any headway-- Irish people tend not to go for that kind of strident rhetoric. But ideas which were previously taboo in Ireland now seem to be increasingly mainstreamed. He might come to regret that, as might everyone who is rushing to nail their colours to the radical right mast.
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Post by assisi on Dec 17, 2018 21:28:17 GMT
Interesting that John Waters has come out in support of Justin Barrett-- at least quoting him approvingly in this interview, and speaking positively of him elsewhere. www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEnOwn4v2YkI cannot see the National Party making any headway-- Irish people tend not to go for that kind of strident rhetoric. But ideas which were previously taboo in Ireland now seem to be increasingly mainstreamed. He might come to regret that, as might everyone who is rushing to nail their colours to the radical right mast. It might be time to pay less attention to the labels of left and right as they are becoming bereft of any meaningful significance in the current political debate. Simply being a Catholic will attract the term right wing by default. Being anti-abortion and pro marriage, in the eyes of the MSM and the majority of politicians and SJWs, is being right wing.
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