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Post by hibernicus on Mar 6, 2013 21:32:28 GMT
I think we would have heard if they had disbanded. They are just a small knot of 12-15 activists, who are scattered and have few resources, so I would expect to only hear from them occasionally.
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Post by hibernicus on Mar 6, 2013 21:38:20 GMT
An Poblacht is a very bad model for a paper because it is the instrument of a top-down authoritarian leadership. Any paper should have room for reasoned debate within limits. Rural seats may have more Catholic voters but they also have stronger party loyalties. Urban seats are more fluid in their allegiance and it would not be impossible for a determined activist to build up support over time with hard work. (Remember PR allows minorities to win seats.) An open tent policy has its limits, especially if a large section of the activists see their views as non-negotiable. I am a bit sceptical about Ganley; he might provide an easily recognisable leader with enough resources and name-recognition for an organisation to form around him, or he might just be on an ego trip. I think he's a risk worth taking, though it is a risk. The point about local electoral bases is absolutely correct. The point about expelling extremists as soon as they pop up likewise.
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Post by hibernicus on Mar 6, 2013 22:06:33 GMT
They wouldn't need to win seats - just to win enough votes on a fairly consistent basis to frighten the major parties into making concessions. This is how small parties have an impact - not that they become big parties, but that the big parties are forced to accommodate their concerns to win back support. (Admittedly it would be hard to keep a party going long-term without hope of winning representation.)
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Mar 7, 2013 9:16:22 GMT
I agree with most of what both Hibernicus and Young Ireland are saying. Whatever about a party, building a publication is a very difficult thing. Hibernicus is right that An Phoblacht is the voice of the SF leadership. But I would say that a well edited newsletter along the lines of David Manly's Family and Life Update would be a necessary feature of a reinvigorated party. A newspaper is a bigger dream - at the moment, I'm sure many FFers are lamenting the demise of the Irish Press.
I would say in relation to CSP or a successor group:
1. It is necessary to do local politics: residents' association involvement, GAA clubs (or their social equivalents - Rugby clubs in Limerick, for example), school boards (very important) or the like. The idea is to have candidates for local authorities. Seats on local authorities are the key to representation in the Dáil, but the CSP and other groups never took them seriously.
2. Many of the independent TDs have dreadful views on abortion - Mick Wallace and Luke Flanagan to name two. These were never a feature in the elections. Likewise, the former Workers' Party won votes and seats in pro-life areas. I am thinking of strongly pro-life Donegal. Look at the representatives there: in SW, you have Dinny McGinley (FG), Pearse Doherty (SF) and Thomas Pringle (an ex-SF independent); in NE, there is Charlie McConalogue (FF), Joe McHugh (FG) and Padraig MacLochlainn (SF). At present, I would only expect the FFer to voice any sentiment against abortion and that might not happen; my guess is Pringle will try to keep quiet on the matter; McGinley will go with the whip; McHugh (whom I know), may make a couple of lame protests before going with the whip; the shinners will try to get away with making sympathetic noises on the qt in Donegal and voting with the party in Leinster House. In other words, the people of Donegal are not represented on this issue. What I say, is that a pro-life group campaign primariliy on local issues. They can mention being pro-life, but understate it in the same way as many public representatives understate their pro-abortion views and views on many other matters.
The bit that the pro-life parties miss is that voters may agree with them on abortion, but it is not an issue which usually informs how they vote in elections one way or another. For that reason, the title 'Christian' in the party name may be a handicap.
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Post by hibernicus on Mar 7, 2013 23:04:39 GMT
And I notice they present some perfectly reasonable discussion on tactics as amounting to seeking support under false pretences. If pro-lifers or Catholics recited the two-times table such people would denounce it as "far right propaganda".
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Mar 12, 2013 9:04:12 GMT
Do the CSP have a candidate in the Meath East by-election?
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Post by hibernicus on Mar 12, 2013 12:35:02 GMT
I haven't seen one listed, though even Direct Democracy Ireland and the Workers' Party are standing. (The Wikipedia entry on the by-election lists declared candidates. All the major parties have now chosen and the date is set, so if the CSP want to run they had better move quickly - and a candidacy might be counterproductive because a very low vote, which would be extremely likely, would be picked up by the pro-choicers as evidence the voters don't oppose abortion.) The Labour candidate is actually making legislating for X his principal issue, so the lower his vote is the better. It's a sign of the times that a major party can treat this as a prospective vote-winner. The SUNDAY BUSINESS POST claims Helen McEntee has doubts about the prospective legislation and is waiting to see the terms before deciding her position. This may be sincere, or it may be protective camouflage devised by FG spin doctors to pacify discontented voters. If I lived in the constituency I would give my number 1 to the FF candidate unless there is some very black mark against him and my number 2 to Ms McEntee. I don't care much for FF, but losing the seat to them might make FG hesitate a bit in their headlong rush to Tophet en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tophet
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Post by Askel McThurkill on Mar 12, 2013 14:15:15 GMT
The FF candidate is Senator Thomas Byrne, who has a track record of making the right kind of noises on moral issues (though he did seriously criticise Alive!, then it is probably a good sign that a relatively young politician saw the newspaper while attending Sunday Mass). Senator Byrne is a scion of the Hilliard family, so he has relatives who attend St Kevin's in Harrington St.
In Meath East FG terms, the late Shane McEntee was the government torch bearer; Regina Doherty was the one who made the concientious objection noises on abortion - so Helen McEntee's conscience could well be spin.
The Labour candidate is Cllr Eoin Holmes, a personable man, but I think he is aware he has no hope. There are a group of independent Meath county councillors based in Duleek and Ashbourne centred around ex-Labour TD Brian Fitzgerald who broke away from the Labour Party after the merger with Democratic Left. These were the backbone of Jimmy Tully's organisation and until the 2011 election, they used to run a candidate to split the Labour vote. They'd have no strong views on abortion. Not sure if any of them (Brian Fitzgerald, Jimmy Cuddy), but they might be worth a preference to bury Labour even further if they are.
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Post by Askel McThurkill on Mar 12, 2013 14:17:50 GMT
BTW, I would say Thomas Byrne is the best bet, if for no other reason than to send FG a message.
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Post by Young Ireland on Mar 12, 2013 18:39:26 GMT
I agree with Askel, though I don't think that criticism of Alive! is much of an acid test for Catholicity, as it contains many ideas which aren't the position of the Church.
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Post by frdavid on Mar 14, 2013 6:39:31 GMT
Dear Brothers and sisters in Christ! Congratulations to you all for having a new pope, Pope Francis 1; a pope people hope can carry the Holy Catholic Church forward and that he can put peoples' problems on his right side hand. Let us continue praying for him; he comes at a time when the world is over weighed with complexities of difficulties both in body and spirit. Today I offered Holy Mass for the new Pope that he should have a enough courage, strength, health of mind and body to perform his pontifical ministry and administration. I also prayed for all the members of Irish catholics' Forum; may the gifts of the Holy Spirit reign in our minds, hearts and spirit; may we through the intervention of the Holy Spirit be the beacon of love, holiness, encouragement, light where there is darkness in the world in Jesus Christ, Amen. Christian Solidarity Party should be encouraged because it takes us back to the real chritains tradition, the time of apostles-where there was that spirit of sharing, receiving and giving! God bless you all. Fr. David sites.google.com/site/solidarityfarmersassociation/frdavid2@archdioceseofgulu.org +256 772 637475
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Post by Askel McThurkill on Mar 18, 2013 20:56:24 GMT
Just occurs to me that Commandant Cathal Loftus lives in Ashbourne, which is in the Meath East constituency.
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Post by hibernicus on Mar 18, 2013 21:12:06 GMT
The independents do not appear to be CSP-backed. One of them, Charlie Keddy, has taken a pro-life stance in the past but basically he's a serial candidate from Wicklow who has no links to the constituency.
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Post by Alaisdir Ua Séaghdha on Mar 22, 2013 9:07:30 GMT
At the end of the day, the race is between Helen McEntee and Thomas Byrne and from a pro-life point of view the latter is better. Another contest that's going on is whether SF's Darren O'Rourke beats Labour's Eoin Holmes into the fourth place, which I think will happen (and this is not anything personal against Cllr Holmes - he's a nice guy and a good councillor. Meath East is not my constituency, but the only reason I would not give him a consideration is due to his party's policy on abortion.) With the Shinners, the vote of the Marie Stopes clinic in Stormont is all we need to know at present, but while Labour have an overt pro-abortion position and SF don't, the Shinners might be given a higher preference on a case by case basis.
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Post by hibernicus on Mar 23, 2013 20:22:38 GMT
It's not just a question of Labour Party policy - Eoin Holmes seems to be personally making legislation for abortion a major issue in his campaign. This should qualify him for the very lowest preference on the ballot paper.
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